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52 Threads found on edaboard.com: fr4 Loss Tangent
fr4 loss tangent is 0,012 - 0,019
Normally, the angle is in degrees. For your problem, loss tangent = tan(.01deg). A reasonable approximation of the loss can be found as: Dielectric loss(dB/in) = 2.3 x freq(Ghz) x tan(delta) x sqrt(Er) This relationship assumes that the metallic losses are much less than the dielectric (...)
Hi, now I am designing LNA microstrip for 2.3 GHz. I must analyse microstrip loss. I using fr4 as substrat. Now I need loss tangent value for 2.3 GHz. I hope any person give me information about that. Because I don't know. When I search in google and read a book, i just found loss tangent (...)
silicon's loss mechanism is not same as dielectric loss. For fr4 material, the DC conductance is zero while AC electrical field will incur loss. Silicon's conductance in DC is not zero. And that means the loss mainly come from the conductivity of the material.
If "cardboard" is meant to refer to a technical printed circuit board substrate, it would be a good idea to use a sligthly more precise specification. Generic fr4 has a loss tangent specification of 0.035 @ 1 MHz.
Basically, your observation is right. The radiation efficiency of patch antennas fabricated in fr4 is low. However, there are several ways to improve the radiation efficiency, at least to some extent. 1) To optimize (roughly saying, to increase) the patch width. For thin substrates the radiation efficiency is improved by making the aspect W/L large
fr4 is not a good material to use at 1 GHz. Use high frequency materials that has a more stable dielectric constant with less loss.
fr4 is not one kind of PCB material - it is an entire class of flame retardant glass and epoxy type board materials. Depending on the resin type and content, an fr4 board can perform quite nicely to 4 or 5 GHz or even higher (there are even 9 GHz backplanes described on the web that were done with fr4). Dielectric constants can vary (...)
Make a search of the board on fr4. This topic had been discussed many times here.
dear all. when i simulate the cpw antenn with fr4 substrate the gain is not uniform over the band of frequencies. what might be the reason? how to correct it? also i need what is gain bandwidth? impedance bandwidth? pattern bandwidth? also what is the permittivity of fr4 with loss (...)
hello all, i have research in WLAN antenna n i need fr4 with spec loss tan 0.0001, ephsilon r 2.2 n thick 0.8mm i need fr4 for subtrate. any one have information about it? where can i get it? thanx b4
fr4 is not just one kind of dielectric. You need to find out what brand and model of fr4 is going to be used. You can then go to that manufacturers web site and download the datasheet which will give you the loss tangent and Er.
hi all! can anyone help me to design a 2.45 GHz three-way power combiner on a fr4 board with substrate permitivity of 4.7 and thickness 1.6 mm, loss tangent 0.0025, copper height is 0.04 mm. impedance is 50-ohm. I only have Ansoft and CST for simulations. i'm kinda new to this but i've already done some research and found out that's (...)
dear roommates i'd like to know the parameters of fr4 εr:? thickness:? Tan delta:? I'm in hurry. thanks in advance
Hi , I would like to know what are the fr4 PCB's available in the market with permittivity & height. Please let me know lower,higher value of both. thanks a lot
Hi, I would like to know the dielectric constant and the loss tangent values for fr4 at 5.9GHz. Do these parameters vary with the material thickness? Thanks,
The rogers program does allow custom parameters to be used. Just edit the parameter values. For fr4 the esubr is 4 and the loss tangent is about 0.02
Diel Const of fr4 can vary from 4.3-4.8 from batch to batch. And is temperature sensitive as well. loss tangent can vary between 0.018-0.030, depending on number of layers, board thickness, etc. Using fr4 as substrate for microwave circuits, requires tolerance analyses of the fr4 parameters in a (...)
Definitely the reason of poor S21 at those frequencies is the fr4 material. For higher frequencies you can use one of these materials from Rogers: Curves lines usually are used in broadband splitters to minimize the total physical length.
PCB is not visible. Try to post once again. If substrate is fr4 (as it seems...) increase to 0.02 the loss tangent (more similar to real value) and see if it oscillates. Use, instead of ideal passive components, vendor library component models (Q and SRF can be important). I hope it can help. Mazz
You don't choose the thickness of the material to control loss - you choose the thickness of the material to control the impedance of the transmission path for a particular trace width. The losses in the dielectric are a function of the material, and not the thickness. High Tg fr4 resin is available with an Er of about 3.7. That is (...)
Dear all, I have questions about the laminate materials for RF circuits/antennas. I know that the cheapest material is fr4. However, its loss tangent Df is very high (@0.018). Are there any other materials with low cost and low loss tangent? Roger series are more expensive than I expected. Thanks,
if i have two layer (fr4) , i want to know how to calculate trace size with 100 ohm impedance . hope advance person can help me . thanks !
can someone help me design an RF amplifier with minimum noise figure using AT414118a for a freq range of 405MHz to 455MHz? PCB is fr4, εr: 4.3 thickness of pcb: 20mil loss tangent: 0.02 cladded with 0.5oz copper on both sides i only know the starting use MS. FRA(εr=4.4) 0.03inch, 0.5oz copper. this is all stated (...)
Diel const of fr4 can vary from 4.3-4.8 from batch to batch. And is temperature sensitive as well. loss tangent can vary between 0.018-0.030, depending on number of layers, board thickness, etc. Using fr4 as substrate for microwave filters, requires accurate tolerance analyses of the fr4 parameters in a (...)
hi guys i'm dealing with a bandpass filter design for my final year project. I have 2 substrates for hardware fabrication : fr4 (er=4.5) and Rogers3010 (RO3010) (er=10.2). The filter is designed for center frequency 2.5GHz and my main goal is overall filter size reduction. Which of the 2 substrates mentioned would be more suitable so
dear all. when i simulate the cpw antenn with fr4 substrate the gain is not uniform over the band of frequencies. what might be the reason? how to correct it? also i need what is gain bandwidth? impedance bandwidth? pattern bandwidth? also what is the permittivity of fr4 with loss tangent value? for what (...)
Hi all, Could any one tell me how to get the detail specifications and vendor information of GTEK and BT laminates of PCB substrates ? i would like to comapre these two laminates with fr4 to see the difference as below : 1. Density ( g/cc ), 2. Coefficient of Thermal Expansion CTE, 3. Glass transition temperature, 4. Deg
you can simulate it at ADS but if you try to make a suspended version there ll be abnormal results. So try it at HFSS. And your choice of fr4 is poor in loss tangent and if you dont use suspended structure you may not obtain needed gain.
Anybody can help me to figure out some hints on the PCB characteristics under high AC voltage? It is ESD generator discharged current/voltage, the max voltage can be up to ~4KV, even higher, and the rising edge could be 0.7~1ns. I am considering if the fr4 eproxy material Dielectric constant and loss tangent would change at such high (...)
Modeling a Powerbus with HFSS Geometry and setup Double-sided PCB: Size: 125 mm × 100 mm × 1 mm Top and bottom metal: PEC Dielectric: fr4, εr = 4.5, dielectric loss tangent = 0.015 Solution type: Driven terminal Excitation: Voltage source (1 V, 50 ohms) Boundary: Radiation Analysis Setup: Solution Frequency: 1.15 (...)
fr4 is very loosy material. So you can not obtain good results. (Look for loss tangent) And also try to elevate your structure(put some air between dielectric and ground plane. it makes magic about gain
hi there, i need to design a 4 element patch antenna array. i have 6inches (w) by 4inches(h) fr4 board. i need to design the array so that feed network, array and impedeance transformer all fit on the stated board can someone please 1)suggest an appropriate operating frequency for the array 2)tell me the dielectric constant, loss tangent (...)
Hi, Can anyone illustrate the extraction method to have the real,imaginary parts of effective permittivity and permeability by simulating a 10 mm long of a 50Ω microstrip line on fr4-Epoxy with thickness of 1.6 mm ε relative=4.4 and loss tangent=0.022;by using HFSS and Matlab. Take a look to my project done by HFSS,the (...)
hi there i am simulating a microstrip power divider and in order to have good match between fabricated and simulated results i thought to include dielectric loss and metal loss. i am simulating with fr4 substrate havng loss tangent of 0.022 and instead of using PEC i am using copper. after simulating i (...)
Only the width of the feedline matters which should be matched to 50 ohm impedance. Length of the feedline plays a minor role when you are using a dielectric substrate with very low loss tangent. For example, for Rogers 6010, loss tangent is 0.0023 compared to the loss tangent of 0.02for (...)
i want to design rectangular microstrip patch antenna for my wpt project....which substrate i should choose???? I have already started working with fr4 for 10Ghz frequency...but performance is not satisfactory.8-O
Hello, Try to reduce the loss tangent of the fr4 material, this should increase the resistance at resonance. 800 MHz (375mm = lambda) and 1.6mm between patch and ground will not give you a good antenna, unless you have another patch above it. If there would be no loss, the impedance should be in the many kOhm range. (...)
To design the 50 ohms transmission lines at the input and output of the module you can use the freeware program below: fr4 fiberglass, Er=4.4, should be fine for your application.
Generaly, unless you sre going to do high gigaHz designs stick with fr4 based laminates, 150Tg are a good choice. Discuss the rest with your PCB manufacturer. I woulkd also reccomend becoming familiar with IPC specifications, the C-1000 series of documents will cover most of what you will you'll face as a PCB designer.
but gain is not coming to 8db Have you simulated with loss tangent for the fr4 substrate? fr4 has high loss tangent and this will reduce the gain of patch antennas. To check if gain is reduced by substrate loss, you could simulate with lossless substrate.
I suggest you use GE fr4 called GETEK which has 10x lower loss tangent than most fr4. W I suspect you are using lossy fr4 and also dielectric constants is much lower at 2Ghz since rated parameter . Also dielectric constant drops 10~20% as f goes up. Return loss of thinner (...)
Do not use std fr4 .. Know what your loss tangent and epsilon with test coupons and make sure tolerance on heli-coil is tested. Impedance matching stripline is basic with many tools online incl. IPC I suspect loss tangent of dielectric will kill the Q of your antenna unless Df<< 0.005 Also if planning to (...)
Hi all can any one tell me which formulas will be applicable for this kind of design any paper for such type of design waiting in anticipation kartik - - - Updated - - - a circular cpw antenna i need how to calculate cpw dimensions central cpw feed length radius of the patch what is the maximum gain which this an
Hi Ali, I think the manufacturer gives you the layers (for example, Cooper) and you map a layer with cooper. The differences between cooper and Metal layers are probably in the properties that cooper has (corrosion, resistance, temperature, conductivity regarding other metals and so on). This are the parameters that every layers has. Plus, the for
best way is stripline transformer using copper and appropriate substrate with low loss tangent such as Getek fr4 or Rogers teflon.
Ur Structure is resonating well for 10 GHz but its bandwidth is High. If u want High Q structure then modifications are to be done but its all depending on ur application. fr4 is a lossy Material. Try giving the value of its loss tangent and simulate the structure again..!! Also, If its a 2 port device, see that ur (...)
Hard to believe that you can get more than 2.35 dBi of gain from this kind of antenna using fr4 (I assume the resonant frequency is 6.5GHz)
Hello! I have a RF reference circuit at 2.4Ghz designed with transmision lines (balun) in 0.8mm separated 2 layer pcb. We are going to design this circuit in a flex-rigid PCB. Instead of having copper/fr4/copper we have Copper/kapton/fr4/copper/fr4/Copper/fr4/Copper We can mantain 0.8mm of thickness but (...)
Think of the loss as an eddy current phase of a wave in a dielectric, not the leakage resistance. ( not technically correct but analogy) So it impedes flow with a loss factor. It is indicated by the tangent of the loss contant for the material in dB and is a function of material type, thickness, and of course frequency. (...)