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# fr4 Loss Tangent

52 Threads found on edaboard.com: fr4 Loss Tangent

## Information about the loss tangent of FR4

Hi, all. These days I've been reading Kin-Lu Wong's book, planar antennas for wireless applicaitons, I was confronted with a question. In this book, lots of printed antennas are printed on fr4, the relative permitivity and the hight of the substrates have been given, but the loss tangent of the substrate hasn't been given. Co

## Question about loss tangent calculation

Normally, the angle is in degrees. For your problem, loss tangent = tan(.01deg). A reasonable approximation of the loss can be found as: Dielectric loss(dB/in) = 2.3 x freq(Ghz) x tan(delta) x sqrt(Er) This relationship assumes that the metallic losses are much less than the dielectric (...)

## Value of loss tangent FR4 for 2.3 GHz ?

Hi, now I am designing LNA microstrip for 2.3 GHz. I must analyse microstrip loss. I using fr4 as substrat. Now I need loss tangent value for 2.3 GHz. I hope any person give me information about that. Because I don't know. When I search in google and read a book, i just found loss tangent (...)

## Loss tangent of High resistive silicon substrate in HFSS

silicon's loss mechanism is not same as dielectric loss. For fr4 material, the DC conductance is zero while AC electrical field will incur loss. Silicon's conductance in DC is not zero. And that means the loss mainly come from the conductivity of the material.

## Loss tangent of cardboard

If "cardboard" is meant to refer to a technical printed circuit board substrate, it would be a good idea to use a sligthly more precise specification. Generic fr4 has a loss tangent specification of 0.035 @ 1 MHz.

## Loss tangent impact in patch antenna

Basically, your observation is right. The radiation efficiency of patch antennas fabricated in fr4 is low. However, there are several ways to improve the radiation efficiency, at least to some extent. 1) To optimize (roughly saying, to increase) the patch width. For thin substrates the radiation efficiency is improved by making the aspect W/L large

## FR4 dielectric constant

fr4 is not a good material to use at 1 GHz. Use high frequency materials that has a more stable dielectric constant with less loss.

## Max operatiing frequency of FR4 board

fr4 is not one kind of PCB material - it is an entire class of flame retardant glass and epoxy type board materials. Depending on the resin type and content, an fr4 board can perform quite nicely to 4 or 5 GHz or even higher (there are even 9 GHz backplanes described on the web that were done with fr4). Dielectric constants can vary (...)

## FR4 Boards under 2GHZ

Make a search of the board on fr4. This topic had been discussed many times here.

## reg material loss and bandwidth--need urgent answers

dear all. when i simulate the cpw antenn with fr4 substrate the gain is not uniform over the band of frequencies. what might be the reason? how to correct it? also i need what is gain bandwidth? impedance bandwidth? pattern bandwidth? also what is the permittivity of fr4 with loss (...)

## Looking for a FR4 with loss tan: 0.0001, epsilon r 2.2 and thickness 0.8mm

hello all, i have research in WLAN antenna n i need fr4 with spec loss tan 0.0001, ephsilon r 2.2 n thick 0.8mm i need fr4 for subtrate. any one have information about it? where can i get it? thanx b4

## How to find out the properties of FR4 in 2.45GHz receiver design?

Hi, Currently designing a 2.45Ghz receiver and was wondering what is the Er and loss tangent with height=1.6mm and thickness=0.03mm fr4? How is it possible to find out? All replies are much appreciated.Thank you in advance!

## need help to design a 3-way power combiner

hi all! can anyone help me to design a 2.45 GHz three-way power combiner on a fr4 board with substrate permitivity of 4.7 and thickness 1.6 mm, loss tangent 0.0025, copper height is 0.04 mm. impedance is 50-ohm. I only have Ansoft and CST for simulations. i'm kinda new to this but i've already done some research and found out that's (...)

## FR4 specification for microwave design

dear roommates i'd like to know the parameters of fr4 εr:? thickness:? Tan delta:? I'm in hurry. thanks in advance

## Specifications of FR4 Epoxy.

Hi , I would like to know what are the fr4 PCB's available in the market with permittivity & height. Please let me know lower,higher value of both. thanks a lot

## FR4 specificatins at 5.9GHz

Hi, I would like to know the dielectric constant and the loss tangent values for fr4 at 5.9GHz. Do these parameters vary with the material thickness? Thanks,

## Power Handling Capability of Microstrip device or antenna

The rogers program does allow custom parameters to be used. Just edit the parameter values. For fr4 the esubr is 4 and the loss tangent is about 0.02

## What are the properties of epoxy material for MWS ?

Diel Const of fr4 can vary from 4.3-4.8 from batch to batch. And is temperature sensitive as well. loss tangent can vary between 0.018-0.030, depending on number of layers, board thickness, etc. Using fr4 as substrate for microwave circuits, requires tolerance analyses of the fr4 parameters in a (...)

## what is the best substrate for a microstrip power divider ?

Definitely the reason of poor S21 at those frequencies is the fr4 material. For higher frequencies you can use one of these materials from Rogers: Curves lines usually are used in broadband splitters to minimize the total physical length.

## How to debug a VCO which doesn oscillate?

PCB is not visible. Try to post once again. If substrate is fr4 (as it seems...) increase to 0.02 the loss tangent (more similar to real value) and see if it oscillates. Use, instead of ideal passive components, vendor library component models (Q and SRF can be important). I hope it can help. Mazz

## Choice of PCB material and thickness @ 5GHz

You don't choose the thickness of the material to control loss - you choose the thickness of the material to control the impedance of the transmission path for a particular trace width. The losses in the dielectric are a function of the material, and not the thickness. High Tg fr4 resin is available with an Er of about 3.7. That is (...)

## Questions on laminate materials for RF circuits/antennas

Dear all, I have questions about the laminate materials for RF circuits/antennas. I know that the cheapest material is fr4. However, its loss tangent Df is very high (@0.018). Are there any other materials with low cost and low loss tangent? Roger series are more expensive than I expected. Thanks,

## How to calculate difference mode trace with 100ohm impedance

if i have two layer (fr4) , i want to know how to calculate trace size with 100 ohm impedance . hope advance person can help me . thanks !

## need help urgently!!! on LNA

is AT414118 a transistor? i don't from which company it is, but it should have an evaluation board from the manufacturer probably also on fr4.

## Microstrip filter design help

Diel const of fr4 can vary from 4.3-4.8 from batch to batch. And is temperature sensitive as well. loss tangent can vary between 0.018-0.030, depending on number of layers, board thickness, etc. Using fr4 as substrate for microwave filters, requires accurate tolerance analyses of the fr4 parameters in a (...)

## substrate selection for bandpass filter design

hi guys i'm dealing with a bandpass filter design for my final year project. I have 2 substrates for hardware fabrication : fr4 (er=4.5) and Rogers3010 (RO3010) (er=10.2). The filter is designed for center frequency 2.5GHz and my main goal is overall filter size reduction. Which of the 2 substrates mentioned would be more suitable so

## need answers-very urgent

dear all. when i simulate the cpw antenn with fr4 substrate the gain is not uniform over the band of frequencies. what might be the reason? how to correct it? --Check the radiation efficiency. You have little control to it. also i need what is gain bandwidth? impedance bandwidth? pattern bandwidth? --Check

## Specifications of GTEK and BT PCB laminate

Hi all, Could any one tell me how to get the detail specifications and vendor information of GTEK and BT laminates of PCB substrates ? i would like to comapre these two laminates with fr4 to see the difference as below : 1. Density ( g/cc ), 2. Coefficient of Thermal Expansion CTE, 3. Glass transition temperature, 4. Deg

## Can i simulate an loop antenna using ADS

you can simulate it at ADS but if you try to make a suspended version there ll be abnormal results. So try it at HFSS. And your choice of fr4 is poor in loss tangent and if you dont use suspended structure you may not obtain needed gain.

## [Qustion] PCB characteristics under high AC voltage ~ 4KV

Anybody can help me to figure out some hints on the PCB characteristics under high AC voltage? It is ESD generator discharged current/voltage, the max voltage can be up to ~4KV, even higher, and the rising edge could be 0.7~1ns. I am considering if the fr4 eproxy material Dielectric constant and loss tangent would change at such high (...)

## How to make each stage of pipeline ADC behave similarly?

Modeling a Powerbus with HFSS Geometry and setup Double-sided PCB: Size: 125 mm × 100 mm × 1 mm Top and bottom metal: PEC Dielectric: fr4, εr = 4.5, dielectric loss tangent = 0.015 Solution type: Driven terminal Excitation: Voltage source (1 V, 50 ohms) Boundary: Radiation Analysis Setup: Solution Frequency: 1.15 (...)

## Getting low gain such as 1.5 in Ansoft HFSS

Hi , I am not able to attched the hfss format so I attached the diagram in doc format. Could you advice me how to attached the hfss file to you? I have done the patch antenna using ansoft hfss v9.1 . The material that I want to use is fr4 and wanted to design for 1.5GHz. I'm getting 1.5dB in peak gain through compute antenna parameters icon.

## esign a 4 element patch antenna array

hi there, i need to design a 4 element patch antenna array. i have 6inches (w) by 4inches(h) fr4 board. i need to design the array so that feed network, array and impedeance transformer all fit on the stated board can someone please 1)suggest an appropriate operating frequency for the array 2)tell me the dielectric constant, loss tangent (...)

## Effective Permittivity and permeability extraction

Hi, Can anyone illustrate the extraction method to have the real,imaginary parts of effective permittivity and permeability by simulating a 10 mm long of a 50Ω microstrip line on fr4-Epoxy with thickness of 1.6 mm ε relative=4.4 and loss tangent=0.022;by using HFSS and Matlab. Take a look to my project done by HFSS,the (...)

## CST warning for lossy material

hi there i am simulating a microstrip power divider and in order to have good match between fabricated and simulated results i thought to include dielectric loss and metal loss. i am simulating with fr4 substrate havng loss tangent of 0.022 and instead of using PEC i am using copper. after simulating i (...)

## Microstrip filters - dimensions

Only the width of the feedline matters which should be matched to 50 ohm impedance. Length of the feedline plays a minor role when you are using a dielectric substrate with very low loss tangent. For example, for Rogers 6010, loss tangent is 0.0023 compared to the loss tangent of 0.02for (...)

## design antenna for wpt

certainly fr4 would be quite lossy at 10 GHz. but as kohi noted, what is the performance parameter that isnt satisfactory? if you end up needing a material wither lower loss tangent then as suggested look at a teflon based material. if you identify a material work with your department at school to secure you a free sheet (...)

## Impédance of Patch Antenna

Hello, Try to reduce the loss tangent of the fr4 material, this should increase the resistance at resonance. 800 MHz (375mm = lambda) and 1.6mm between patch and ground will not give you a good antenna, unless you have another patch above it. If there would be no loss, the impedance should be in the many kOhm range. (...)

## UHF Amplifier Problem

To design the 50 ohms transmission lines at the input and output of the module you can use the freeware program below: fr4 fiberglass, Er=4.4, should be fine for your application.

## Selecting a laminate for PCB

Generaly, unless you sre going to do high gigaHz designs stick with fr4 based laminates, 150Tg are a good choice. Discuss the rest with your PCB manufacturer. I woulkd also reccomend becoming familiar with IPC specifications, the C-1000 series of documents will cover most of what you will you'll face as a PCB designer.

## need comments on this antenna

but gain is not coming to 8db Have you simulated with loss tangent for the fr4 substrate? fr4 has high loss tangent and this will reduce the gain of patch antennas. To check if gain is reduced by substrate loss, you could simulate with lossless substrate.

## Substrate thickness problem in patch antenna

I suggest you use GE fr4 called GETEK which has 10x lower loss tangent than most fr4. W I suspect you are using lossy fr4 and also dielectric constants is much lower at 2Ghz since rated parameter . Also dielectric constant drops 10~20% as f goes up. Return loss of thinner (...)

## how to match impedence of copper helical antenna in HFSS operating at 2.4GHz

Do not use std fr4 .. Know what your loss tangent and epsilon with test coupons and make sure tolerance on heli-coil is tested. Impedance matching stripline is basic with many tools online incl. IPC I suspect loss tangent of dielectric will kill the Q of your antenna unless Df<< 0.005 Also if planning to (...)

## how to calcute antenna dimensions for cpw fed microstrip patch antenna for UWB antenn

Hi all can any one tell me which formulas will be applicable for this kind of design any paper for such type of design waiting in anticipation kartik - - - Updated - - - a circular cpw antenna i need how to calculate cpw dimensions central cpw feed length radius of the patch what is the maximum gain which this an

## AWR PCB Manufacturing

Hi Ali, I think the manufacturer gives you the layers (for example, Cooper) and you map a layer with cooper. The differences between cooper and Metal layers are probably in the properties that cooper has (corrosion, resistance, temperature, conductivity regarding other metals and so on). This are the parameters that every layers has. Plus, the for

## Low Noise Amplifier output match

best way is stripline transformer using copper and appropriate substrate with low loss tangent such as Getek fr4 or Rogers teflon.

## Problem in S-parameter graph

Ur Structure is resonating well for 10 GHz but its bandwidth is High. If u want High Q structure then modifications are to be done but its all depending on ur application. fr4 is a lossy Material. Try giving the value of its loss tangent and simulate the structure again..!! Also, If its a 2 port device, see that ur (...)

## please guide me in my design of antenna

Hard to believe that you can get more than 2.35 dBi of gain from this kind of antenna using fr4 (I assume the resonant frequency is 6.5GHz)

## Flex-Rigid PCB RF design

We can mantain 0.8mm of thickness but the 4.2 permittivity needed, is "disturbed" by 60um of kapton (permittivity 3.5). The equivalent value for this sandwich is t=0.86mm with permittivity 4.14 The deviation in permittvity is small compared to the large tolerances of fr4 permittivity. For the change in substrate thick

## Lossless dielectric material

Think of the loss as an eddy current phase of a wave in a dielectric, not the leakage resistance. ( not technically correct but analogy) So it impedes flow with a loss factor. It is indicated by the tangent of the loss contant for the material in dB and is a function of material type, thickness, and of course frequency. (...)