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79 Threads found on edaboard.com: Victim Aggressor
which book is good for info on Fanout (wire loading, delay modeling, Fanout threshold,) drivers, victim / aggressor(Dominant aggressor, aggressor / driver, P:N widths) Wire Capacitance(Model Capacitors ) , Keeper Circuits, Power P Chains, Interconnect, etc.., in a single book.
TWF contains timing window & slew data . Tools find the earliest & latest arrival times for each victim net & aggressor net.The range of switching times from earliest to latest arrival,defines a timing window for victim net & defines another timing timing window for aggressor net.Crosstal effects occur when (...)
TWF contains timing window & slew data . Tools find the earliest & latest arrival times for each victim net & aggressor net.The range of switching times from earliest to latest arrival,defines a timing window for victim net & defines another timing timing window for aggressor net.Crosstal effects occur when (...)
Nets switching at high frequency (Ex: clock nets, High freq data nets) (aggressors) affect the nets adjacent to it (victim). This is due to the coupling capacitance between the two nets.
Hi, While doing STA with OCV and xtalk ON, using PrimeTime SI, is there any way by means of which I can control timing windows. Basically what I am asking is, when we turn ON both OCV and Xtalk we usually see lot of timing violations (because of pessimism introduced). To remove pessimism we can apply some filters like filtering
It is important to use a Pulse witha rise time the same as or close to what your circuit will see, of course 1 aggressor 1 victim measurement will not show you what to expect witha large number of signals switching simultaneously or close to simultaneous, however, you may find in this situation the return path may be the main crosstalk generating o
eda software , such as signal storm, can report victim net and aggressor net. you first set up a threshold of coupled capacitance, then fix victim net by upsizing cell or double spacing , or routing in different layer.
Above high noise: When the victim net is static high and the aggressor net switches from 0 to 1, there will be a noise bump in the victim net. The magnituge of this voltage bump will be greater than VDD. Below low noise: This occurs when the victim net is static low and the aggressor net switches from (...)
hello, In an affected net, what will u work on first , aggressor or victim?????????????? pls reply soon thanks, Prasad
i would normally put my gnd on the bottom side..Vcc on top side with ample area distibution..i wouldn't call it planes..you could also stitch your gnd on the bottom to the top..mainly for protecting victim lines or isolating the aggressor lines..again, it all depends on your app..
SI can effect the delay throught a net by either increasing its delay (effecting setup time) or decreasing its delay (effecting hold time). Imagine a net with a weak driver (victim net) surrounded by nets with stronger drivers (aggressor nets). If all the nets switch from low to high around the same time, the aggressor nets can help pull (...)
Glitches on a victim net are caused by switching of nearby aggressor net(s) and the coupling capacitance between vitim and aggressors. This can lead to incorrect data to be captured by a flop and thus a functional error. Delay noise is similar but the victim net is also switching. This can cause the (...)
In asic terminology .. cross talk between aggressor net and victim net causes Glitch and some delay is also induced hence to avoid glitch ..double spacing is maintained for clock net Shiv
reflection, termination, transmission-line impedance continuity, etc... All are same dude, Reflection is cross talk- Signal strength flowing in one wire (aggressor) will affect the other (victim), maens a crosstlak refelects Termination- Is electromigration, due to more cureent flowing than requried the wire may br
IF agressor and victim are moving in the same direction how do we get setup violation?
Hi, iwpia50s is correct. All of you know that the victim is the weaker net then your aggressor. So if you insert the buffer in the victim net your victim net will become little stronger, then you know..... Prithivi.
Crosstalk is the unintended signal distortion due to coupling capacitance between two neighbouring nets. Due to decreasing process nodes to cope with the requirment of routing, additional metal layers are being used. The width of these additonal metal layers is decreasing rapidly and the height of these additonal metal layers is increasing.
In order to get answer you need to know the emission level for your aggressor equipment and what is the coupling to the victim microstrip line. Finding these values usually more difficult than make right design and eliminate EMI.
Hi, It depends on slew(transition) of aggressor net and coupling capacitance between aggressor and victim net. Regards,
Hi. I think you can use the following way: 1. insert some buffers or inverters on this victim net. Then it will reduce the parallel length between these two nets. It is very useful. 2. expand the space between these two nets. You can use the shielding or layer change. If the routing resource is ok, you can leverage the victim routing
We know that breaking the victim net by adding a buffer will remove the cross-talk violations. What is the basic concept behind this?
Hi, I know we can upsize the victim net so that coupling is reduced. If by upsizing say the victim becomes the agressor ? My Question is what is the best method to deal with crosstalk in this scenario ? Note: There is no space to shield the aggressor net. It would be great if u could elaborate and provide some good materials (...)
Thank You...Plz can u name some victim signals, normally occurs in Analog layout... diff pair inputs,diff pair outputs ,biasing signals
Hello all! As a part of project, I'm doing PCI Express simulations where topology looks like: PCB1 (Intel)>---->connectors&cable>------>PCB2--->CEM--->Gfx card (TI). The graphics card uses PCI Express generation 1, single lane (x1), so that what we will be using. I'm doing this simulations in HyperLynx 8.1.1. I have some question I h
You can begin with the concepts of "aggressor" and "victim". Every conductor in your assembly with a time-varying voltage or current launches electric or magnetic fields, and electromagnetic radiation. Every conductor is also an antenna and any attached device a potential receiver / amplifier. Now many of these are minuscule in scale, sensitivi
Hi; As i know in basics; Simply set apart aggressor and victim lines/planes. Place groun lines between them Try to use different layers May be some experts here can do better commends.
Can the setup and hold violation occur at the same time for a victim net if it has any number of aggressors? ---------- Post added at 16:55 ---------- Previous post was at 16:55 ---------- I think i found the answer to it... correct me if i am wrong it will not have both at the same time ..meaning.. at s
hi all , I came to know that during PT SI crosstalk analysis calculation , The first step is to consider infinite arrival window to nets , i.e nets can switch any time . I have few doubts 1) Is this infinite arrival window considered for aggressor/victim or both ? 2) Why is it done ? 3) wont it make calculation more pessimistic ? Please
Hello, I have a question about coupling capacitance.... Will the capacitance be formed between any metal layers ?? For example can it be formed between similar metal layers M1-M1. I understand it can be formed between different metal layers M1-M2, M2-M3 etc... Also can the capacitance formed between M1-M5 M2-M6 like that
victim. If you have guard traces around a net that are not connected to anything, you actually jus t make a bad antenna that will not do much. You want to make that guard as low impedance as possible so that radiated energy that hits is quickly funneled away.!
When two wire segment are in close proximity, they interact with each other electrically, this is an account of coupling capacitor between these two nets. This phenomenon is called crosstalk. or you can say, victim net gets affected by aggressor net. To avoid cross talk, you can insert buffer in victim net to increase strength, use double (...)
I am, for the second time, victim of the dumb date protection in Flexlm attacking you when it thinks the date has been changed to some past value. This time, I was testing a NTP client and I really had no way checking if the time would go back or forth when it adjusts. Mentor recognizes also that this protection is too
Hi, Can you describe your questions in more detail? Not sure you want to know the mechanism of the crosstalk or something else. If you want to know something about the cosstalk in between coupled TLs caused by parasitic inductance and capacitance, I can give you a brief description. Anytime, there is a step up/down source change, it will coup
An electromagnetic wave consists of two components; E, H physically at right angles to each other, and at right angle to the direction of propogation: . E Field is the electrical component . H Field is the magnetic component. The relative importance of the E, H fields depends on the impedance of the receptor (victim). If the impedance is high
High Speed PCB High Speed PCB Design Ride the Wave Workshop 58 pages presentation Post Route Analysis of a High Post Route Analysis of a High Speed PCB Design Speed PCB Design Design/Analysis for Power Delivery System (PDS) Goals for this Presentation ? Show the integration between Allegro and PCB/MCM ? Show mixed 2D and 3D
Hi , If I understand correctly . There is a timing window where any agressor effect on victim could introduce a spike which intern will cause a violation . Thanks & Regards yln
I am using TPS65100 (the switching frequency is fixed at 1.6MHZ) triple power supply chip, the problem is how I can analyze the signal integrity of my PCB including this power supply chip. Thank you.
Hi, You can imagine a scenario like when the victim net is not having any driving voltage, a noise voltage gets induced into it due to capacitive coupling with the aggressors. If this noise voltage exceeds the logic threshold voltage, a logic transition may be caused on the gate begin driven by the victim line which can cause functional (...)
Is it possible to detect the heartbeat of a person within a proximity of few centimeters away from the body? The scope is to detect the removal of a device which must be kept near the body all the time, but in most of the cases, the person in unaware of the presence of the device. /pisoiu
Hello All, After I used many years Calibre and from time to time Dracula for layout parasitic extractions, now I have to do this with Assura. I find few things that put me in a difficult position, and make to untrust Assura results. (Like a conffirmation that Assura don't work properly) Description case 1: I have two wide metals (metal 1 and
mostly victim .. because if u try to move aggressive it may affect at some other place..... it all depends on the metal available to move or sheiding can be done.. Regards Shankar
Hello, I'm trying to guard some high impedance nets that have sub nano ampere currents in Protel DXP 2004 for a 2 layers board. I can create polygons in the sensitive area and attach the polygon to a high quality follower of the sensitive net but it is not satisfactory. Some areas of the polygons can't be attached to the rest of polygon because of
Well, if a circuit is operating at high-frequencies and radiates signals (either due to an intentional antenna connected to the circuit or due to stray inductances)....the electro-magnetic signals thus generated are capable of inducing a voltage (commensurate with the original signal) in any stray inductance (e.g. a long wire piece) and thus interf
hi any one tell me what is the need of CTS&what CTS will do,what is there in clock tree spesification file,& what r the operations performed in cts optimisation thanks& regards
you need to separate between the analog & digital block, most probably the digital is the main noise source & the sensitive analog blocks are the victim (Like VCOs CPs ,etc..) hence these analog blocks need shielding & to be as far as possible from the digital blocks Hope it will be useful for you Rania
Can anyone explain me the shielding concept in detail ?? Why do we need to shield with Vdd and why do we need to shield with Vss?? Reply me
Noise does affect current. Depending on the rest of the circuit, this current may, or may not, lead to a significant voltage change. Let's look at the three basic mechanisms involved in noise as it occurs in ICs: (a) Capacitive coupling between signal wires: This is the dominant noise effect on modern ICs. Due to their proximity, two adjace
Hi, Consider this scenario. Consider an inverter with an input net and an output net connected it. There is a neighbouring net which is actually a floating net and there is no transition on this net. What is the effect of this floating net in terms of signal integrity on the nets connected to inverter where there is a transition from low
Dear Sirs, i am hardware designer and i'm having a problem with radiated emission from multilayer PCB. Can i use CST or Mentor tools for simulate and resolve this kind of EMC problem? In the past i used these software for microwave circuits design, but never for PCB with microcontroller on board. Regards
Formula: I/N (Δf)= Pt + mask(Δf) + corr_band+ Gt(β) + Gr (θ)? Att -N where: - Pt: transmitted power of the interferer in dBm - mask(Δf): adjacent frequency attenuation due to the mask when Δf is the difference between the carriers of the interferer and the victim. - corr_band: corrective factor of